...Jesus-ween? Seriously!?

[PracticalAl]

No worries, Mr. Spencer, and I agree.

Unlike creationism though, atheism and agnosticism don't have any belief system or anything else. It's just normal human being common sense, it's how everyone is unless they have been brainwashed from outside influences at a young age (i.e. parents who were also brainwashed at a young age).

Not true. Atheism requires faith as you are putting your faith in the belief that there is no God, which cannot be proven unless one is omnipotent. And contrary to popular belief, "normal" human sense is usually belief in a faith of some sort. We are programmed to seek for God. Children can also be brainwashed to be atheists, it's not exclusive to religious beliefs. Just look at any modern school or college curriculum.

[Mr. Spencer]

People are all too happy to make documentaries and label religious groups as extremists, or accuse them of brainwashing, like televangelists do. But isn't that what Richard Dawkins does whenever he makes a documentary? Brainwashing the younger generation into believing his opinion instead?

There's extremism on all sides, every religion, every perspective. With everyone else caught in between this clusterfuck of filibustering and brainwashing.

See, that was an issue which the Emperor of Mankind underestimated. He believed that mankind should follow a mantra of science, logic and reason. Yet the thing is, humanity needs to believe in something more than what we perceive in the physical realm, we need to believe in something more. In short, we need faith. In something, anything. Of course, the Emperor was later seen as a god, despite his wishes for the opposite and ironically enough it was mankind's faith in the Emperor as a god which united them more than when they followed the Emperor's perspective of logic and reason.

[Ununoctium]

No worries, Mr. Spencer, and I agree.



Not true. Atheism requires faith as you are putting your faith in the belief that there is no God, which cannot be proven unless one is omnipotent. And contrary to popular belief, "normal" human sense is usually belief in a faith of some sort. We are programmed to seek for God. Children can also be brainwashed to be atheists, it's not exclusive to religious beliefs. Just look at any modern school or college curriculum.

Children aren't born to be like "OMG IS THERE A GOD I MUST KNOW RIGHT NOW!" or anything like that. And just because we have freedom and don't have state-sponsored religion in schools like Saudi Arabia, doesn't "breed atheism and agnosticism" it's called secularism. Something that most creationists, especially Christians and Muslims fail to understand. They don't seem to understand the whole US Constitution, especially the whole separation of church and state thing. Also, how can secular schools brainwash kids into "believing in atheism"? Atheism and agnosticism is about as much of a belief as "not stamp collecting" is a hobby.

A bit off-topic, but it just amuses me to no end that Christians and Muslims claim they are "pro-life" yet their religions have killed more people than Hitler, Gaddafi, Stalin, and all the other dictators combined. And they also support the killing of abortion doctors, homosexuals, and the death penalty. So I guess they aren't so "pro-life" after all, are they?

[PracticalAl]

Nicely written post, Spencer. Well put.

Children aren't born to be like "OMG IS THERE A GOD I MUST KNOW RIGHT NOW!" or anything like that. And just because we have freedom and don't have state-sponsored religion in schools like Saudi Arabia, doesn't "breed atheism and agnosticism" it's called secularism. Something that most creationists, especially Christians and Muslims fail to understand. They don't seem to understand the whole US Constitution, especially the whole separation of church and state thing. Also, how can secular schools brainwash kids into "believing in atheism"? Atheism and agnosticism is about as much of a belief as "not stamp collecting" is a hobby.

It amuses me to no end that Christians and Muslims claim they are "pro-life" yet their religions have killed more people than Hitler, Gaddafi, Stalin, and all the other dictators combined. And they also support the killing of abortion doctors, homosexuals, and the death penalty. So I guess they aren't so "pro-life" after all, are they?

Actually.. People are born with a sense to desire God, whether you follow it or not, however, is a different matter altogether. Children especially, unless already influenced by parents, will question the existence of a God at some point in there life. I do agree that most Christians are bad examples of Christianity, but you cannot judge a religion based on it's followers. You must make judgements according to the teachings, and nowhere in the Bible does it command followers to kill anyone. The Christians who do the killing, are the extremists Mr. Spencer were talking about. (The Quran, however.. That's a different story.) and as for the the most deaths, can't argue with the Muslim climbing the ranks, but actually communist (secular) regimes are responsible for the most deaths. Muslims are getting up there, though.

[Ununoctium]

People are born with a sense to desire God

Bullocks, people aren't born with a sense of a desire for a god or anything even remotely similar. People may eventually want to discover the secrets of life, the universe, and everything. But that is not some ultra-Christian "search for god." And if the word "search for god" was used, it would have been said as a byproduct of a brainwashed society, and not human nature.

you cannot judge a religion based on it's followers.

That's the only thing you can judge a group of people by, their actions.

nowhere in the Bible does it command followers to kill anyone.

Wrong, both the Quran and the Bible preach death to all non-believers, homophobia, sexism, and racism (especially slavery).

[PracticalAl]

No, judging people by their actions is not an equivalent to the teachings. I can grow up to be a terrible person despite my parents teaching me nothing but good things. It would be unfair to judge my parents for it. I am solely responsible. Also, most atheists I have dealt with are assholes. So does that mean the tenants of atheism require you to be an asshole? No, of course ntot. Can't judge a teaching based on the followers.

Wrong, both the Quran and the Bible preach death to all non-believers, homophobia, sexism, and racism (especially slavery).

I know the Quran does, I agree. But show me the the verses in the Bible where God commands followers to kill.

[Ununoctium]

I know the Quran does, I agree. But show me the the verses in the Bible where God commands followers to kill.

Deuteronomy 13:8

Also, in regard to our earlier "quest for the meaning of life" discussion earlier, I recommend you watch this video:

[PracticalAl]

Deuteronomy 13:8

Also, in regard to our earlier "quest for the meaning of life" discussion earlier, I recommend you watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF3yb1g30Io

You can't cherry pick verses to make them fit your own context, you must read the surrounding verses, and in some cases, the whole chapter. Read all of Deuteronomy Ch.13. It speaks of false prophets, hence why you must shield yourself against them. Deuteronomy. is also an Old Testament tenant, meant for the believers in those days. The people back then were under different rules and commands, such as the Law of Moses. So it doesn't even apply to believers today, anyway.

13:1 "If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, 13:2 and the sign or the wonder comes true, concerning which he spoke to you, saying, 'Let us go after other gods (whom you have not known) and let us serve them,' 13:3 you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams; for the Lord your God is testing you to find out if you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul. 13:4 "You shall follow the Lord your God and fear Him; and you shall keep His commandments, listen to His voice, serve Him, and cling to Him. 13:5 "But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has counseled rebellion against the Lord your God who brought you from the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of slavery, to seduce you from the way in which the Lord your God commanded you to walk. So you shall purge the evil from among you. 13:6 ¶ "If your brother, your mother's son, or your son or daughter, or the wife you cherish, or your friend who is as your own soul, entice you secretly, saying, 'Let us go and serve other gods' (whom neither you nor your fathers have known, 13:7 of the gods of the peoples who are around you, near you or far from you, from one end of the earth to the other end), 13:8 you shall not yield to him or listen to him; and your eye shall not pity him, nor shall you spare or conceal him.

I will bookmark that video and watch it when I have the time, thank you.

[Vogue_Dirge]

As much as religion has been made an excuse to kill others, let us not forget the massive amount of charity work churches do across the globe, helping those in third world countries. Compassion and good deeds can come from faith and a love for God.

[Mr. Spencer]

I believe in the only true God.



The rest of you are heretics.

[Stars_g36]

I myself am Agnostic, I respect people's beliefs in religion and such and I still celebrate holidays because they are more of a Family get together and spend time with each other. People can do what ever they feel the want to do. But I feel that people shouldn't fix what isn't broken. If they want to do their own Halloween type of deal then so be it, but don't ruin the rest of it for everyone else. I remember Halloween being huge when I was a little kid, now it seems like no one celebrates it like they use to. Such a shame really. Was a fun holiday.

[Alexia_Ashford]

Well, I don't really know what I believe. But, you know, I want to. I want to believe.

Spoiler:

show spoiler

[Mr. Spencer]

The truth is out there, everyone.

[Ununoctium]

As much as religion has been made an excuse to kill others, let us not forget the massive amount of charity work churches do across the globe, helping those in third world countries. Compassion and good deeds can come from faith and a love for God.

Those monasteries aren't there to just "help the poor little starving kids" they're there to convert them to Christianity first and foremost.

[PracticalAl]

Those monasteries aren't there to just "help the poor little starving kids" they're there to convert them to Christianity first and foremost.

First off, no one can be "converted" by anyone else. It's a choice you must make between you and God personally. Secondly, I've been to several Christian-run charity events and not once was anyone "forced" to "convert" nor even preached to. And even when church material is present at charity events or shelters, they're pamphlets or books that are taken by the volition of the people. Never forced.

Seems you have alot of misconceptions about Christianity and/or are making judgements based on select groups of Christians. I suggest finding a non-denominational website or church with a pastor versed in the original languages present in the Bible, if you wish to correct such misconceptions.

I recommend either:

http://www.barahministries.com/

http://johnfarley.org/

And of course, you can always talk to me!