Resident Evil: Operation Raccoon City

[[STARS]TyranT]

And yet there was a moment of pure magic, and that when I arrived at the clock tower, and lo and behold 2 of the rooms were remade, it wasn't perfect, but it had more magic than anything thus far, and for that one moment it felt like we were in our Raccoon again, and not Slant 6's.

[Smiley]

I was just enjoying myself when I took down undead to moonlight sonata. Felt poetic.

[Darkmoon]

Honestly? I think it would have been a lot more impressive if they'd worked within the existing framework. I'm calling them lazy because it feels, at least to me, like they've just gone, 'fuck it, who cares if they had previous street layouts, let's just make our own and shoot more guns!' Assuming they actually knew Raccoon City had a layout. Did the wiki mention it?

I honestly cannot accept that it's just not possible for a minute and 30 second scene with no to light fighting where the characters, you know, talk. Would that really cause people to yank the disc out and hurl it from a window screaming, 'NOT ENOUGH STIMULATION!' if the bugs didn't stop them? I'm not saying that they should even have all the streets from the old games. But there were some pretty major streets, mostly cut up into easily loadable sections, which they could have gone done before the barricades and car crashes happened.

Excuse the shitty copy and paste;



You can see a pretty major road going by the RPD. The gap is for the bus, obviously. Without those blocks and such there it's not a small road - you could certainly have a boss fight of some kind there. And then you can go and explore whole new sections of the city instead of, you know, making a whole new one anyway, slapping Raccoon City on some signs and hoping no one will notice. The downtown area also has some pretty major roads - again, you don't actually see a lot of them because the mess means they're chopped up, but you can see the outline.

[Dracarys]

^^ If S6 unblocked those roads people would complain they are not blocked.

[Darkmoon]

Probably true, but it would still be better than creating a brand new Raccoon City...why even set the game in the city if you aren't gonna get the most out of location? Besides, it's not as though those roads were built with barricades on them - do it near the start of the Outbreak and most people won't complain. You could even show how some of those crashed vehicles crashed and, y'know, add to the plot a little.

[Archelon]

So all I factor is that ORC being linear doesn't work yet RE4 and RE5 do.

Resident Evils 4 and 5 are nowhere near as linear as Operation Raccoon City, and Resident Evil 4 is much less linear than Resident 5, at that.

However, the reason why it works in those games is because, as I said, of the pacing. There are breaks in the action, whether in the form of vehicle sections, moderate puzzle solving, or even light exploration. Both games take time to set the mood and establish an atmosphere (perhaps less so with RE5, but that's a discussion for another time). People accuse these games of being little more than "enter arena, kill enemies, walk down corridor to next arena, kill enemies, lather, rinse, repeat," but it's just not true. There's much more to them than that.

ORC, on the other hand, fits that description to a T. Now, before you get up in arms and claim that because ORC is a third person shooter, it shouldn't have any of those things (or we shouldn't have expected it to have any of those things), look at another TPS franchise such as Gears of War. Or even something like Vanquish. Both are unequivocally TPS games, but even they offer more to do in their campaigns than ORC. The reason why they work where ORC doesn't is because these games do interesting things with their setups. Vanquish, in particular, is arguably just as short as ORC, and yet it offers way more variety and much better pacing than ORC.

ORC doesn't do anything interesting with its environments to take advantage of the new gameplay style. Developers like Epic understand that it's not enough to make a competent shooter. You have to create environments that engage the player and offer increasingly unique scenarios that take advantage of those mechanics. Both RE4 and RE5 did this in spectacular fashion. ORC simply relies more on nostalgia and hopes no one will notice the difference.

[Det. Beauregard]

It doesn't matter if it's a spinoff, a main title, whether it was developed by a Western team or a Japanese team, or if it was in development for years or a matter of months.

It's still a bad game.

But the point is that regardless of this game's production values, it's simply poorly designed. All the production value in the world can't save a game if it isn't designed well.

Well said.

I suppose the story being near non-existant didn't help.

It sure didn't. Am I mistaken, or wasn't there supposed to be like 18 minutes or so of cut scenes? I'm assuming much of it was saved for the Spec Ops DLC which (after the first mission) will surely be overpriced.

Linear design never stopped RE4 and RE5.

Oh, I definitely think it hindered RE5. If I had to guess, with the inclusion of the forced co-op/AI partner thing, the developers decided to make the game far more linear than RE4. I wonder if the game would have been more similar to RE4's level design if it was a solo Chris campaign only. Thinking about it makes me a sad panda.

Limited BOWs? They had a great range of monsters. Even brought back the Crimson Heads. Plus when did a short supply of BOW variety make the game automatically poor? Revelations would like a word with you.

Revelations has more enemy types than ORC, but more of them were similar to each other and less unique than the classic enemies. But that's beside the point - I actually agree with you here. There are enough BOW types in ORC to have made for a good game. The lack of giant spiders, drain deimos, brain suckers, etc. isn't what make this a poor game - the overall game design does. And even if they did have more enemy diversity, no matter how much you polish a turd, at the end of the day it's still a piece of feces.

You say it's lazy, and would probably argue it's not creative like others have said. But making your own stuff is never lazy. It does take effort. Regardless, you can still spot each location and know where it's supposed to be in the city.

If you ask me, taking the time to actually research the locations and environments from RE2, RE3, and the Outbreaks and faithfully re-creating them to the best of their power (while making some small sacrifices for the TPS squad-based nature of the game) would take a lot more work than making a new city from scratch that simply doesn't resemble Raccoon in the slightest. In doing so, Slant Six created a bland, boring, lifeless city that many fans of the series cannot relate to, as it is not the Raccoon they knew from previous games. I know I'm not the only one who thinks this is true.

Headcrabs(thats all they are, we just need to accept it)

So very true. More evidence of Slant Six's unoriginality.

The RE series hasnt really had side quests in the main game, but we're at a point now where developers should be doing this more.

I agree; such mechanics cut down on linearity.

RE4 is in no way as linear as RE5, just because you keep saying it is, doesnt mean it is. Do you even remember the optional paths in RE4? There weren't a huge amount of them, but they were there and gave some extra fights along the way.

I'm glad there are others who realize this. Sure, RE4 was linear compared to the cramped confines and maze-like "recursive unlocking" of the earlier games, but compared to many games of its style today, it might as well have been considered open-world. There are multiple side paths, multiple ways to tackle the tough sections, a fair amount of exploration, and the ability to return to previous areas. RE5 had almost none of this; it was literally a point A-to-point B affair. Although I've yet to play ORC, videos have shown me that it's just as linear as RE5. It puts me to sleep.

Exploration (item scrounging, scavenger hunts) is the most important part of a game to me; the less there is, the less I'll like the game. Just my opinion.

As I said, there aren't a huge number of streets in RE2, and not that many more in RE3. Unless you need full on, run and gun action all the time, why can't these be light action areas transitioning to new, action crammed areas? Why just change the whole layout? Does this game never allow moments where you aren't shooting things in the face?

Even if you must be fighting enemies all the times, and have decided that removing barricades and destroyed vehicles to open up some fairly long street areas (how many streets actually ended at a wall or junction and how many were barricaded or had a crashed vehicle?) is just impossible, then you could still use those areas for small, frentic fights with monsters that you'd usually prefer to engage at close range to make more panicking situations.

The Raccoon City streets already there could have been incorporated. It's not impossible. Not by any stretch. An area where you aren't fighting Special Forces isn't really that big and impossible, and might even make the monsters more than a background noise from what you've said (something I'd consider another nail in the games coffin - how did the monsters destroy the whole city if guys with guns are so much better than them? Why would Umbrella's B.O.W department, the bit that didn't know Spencer's master plan, make multi-million dollar that your average four man squad with assault rifles can take down?) or just a bit that's quiet and allows for some conversation to enhance the story.

Instead they made a whole new city map. Despite what you say, I don't think it was to make the game flow more smoothly. If they wanted to do that they might have done some beta testing. I think it;s the same reason you use guns and see cars from the wrong time period, why information from a wiki is included and why so many people are finding so many bugs - Slant Six just don't have high enough production values to make a game like this, for this big a franchise.

Amen to this.

As I was trying to say to Smiley earlier, I understand taking some creative liberty with the building interiors or widening the streets a bit. However, the style of architecture of the city is completely different. Why would Slant Six feel the need to change that? Simply put - this is not Raccoon City! One trek through the Smithsonian-sized city hall (for a small/mid-sized Midwestern town) should provide enough evidence for that.

And yet there was a moment of pure magic, and that when I arrived at the clock tower, and lo and behold 2 of the rooms were remade, it wasn't perfect, but it had more magic than anything thus far, and for that one moment it felt like we were in our Raccoon again, and not Slant 6's.

The only areas I've seen that even resemble the canon locations are those clock tower areas and a few sections of the RPD (main hall, front plaza). Was there anything in Birkin's lab that was similar to the canon location? I can't recall.

I honestly cannot accept that it's just not possible for a minute and 30 second scene with no to light fighting where the characters, you know, talk. Would that really cause people to yank the disc out and hurl it from a window screaming, 'NOT ENOUGH STIMULATION!' if the bugs didn't stop them?

In this ADHD generation of gamers? Yes, it's too much to ask.

BTW, I agree with the rest of your post with the maps and all. I could have worked well.

If S6 unblocked those roads people would complain they are not blocked.

I don't think so. I'd rather have streets that are similar to the actual layout of the city (blocked or not) than something brand-new that simply doesn't resemble the city at all.

Besides, it's not as though those roads were built with barricades on them - do it near the start of the Outbreak and most people won't complain. You could even show how some of those crashed vehicles crashed and, y'know, add to the plot a little.

Based on the available evidence, this seems to be out of range of Slant Six's capabilities.

ORC simply relies more on nostalgia and hopes no one will notice the difference.

You seem to be correct, and it's a sad thing. If Slant Six actually had more plot in the game that made some sense with the plot of RE2 and RE3 and faithfully re-created the locations, nostalgia may have actually worked (regardless of the lack of survival horror). Instead, we have not-Raccoon and Leon and Claire pinned down in a massive train yard which they never actually visited in the canon.

I hope the Spec Ops campaign tries to nail things more accurately, but I'm just going to assume it will be as bad as the USS one. Hell, they'll probably re-use most of the USS campaign locations; then we'll know for sure how lazy Slant Six really is!

[rehunk88]

Finally got it and completed it
its not a outbreak classic sadly and it was way to short.. but for what it was worth hell a 8/10 from me its not a totally crap game as the reviews says but as i said i was hoping it would be longer plus why only claire leon ( ada for 5 min) and nicolai where was the rest it did feel like a unfinished game or els they cut stuff out for dlc later on but yeah 8/10 from me.

[CrimsonElder]

I did a bad thing.... :-( .....I feel dirty....Embarrased......Ashamed......I went to Blockbusters just to have a look wasnt decided on buying it or anything in all honesty was hoping to rent it. One of the workers there said he just bought it and how terrible it is and he was looking to sell it asap. So I gave him £30.....I need a shower.

One positive is I didnt boost their sales which looks like they are doing pretty damn well, he said there was people phoning all day to get it and couldnt find it anywhere. Sold out everywhere. At least I bought it second hand though. Uhhhhh I need to go wash and throw up.

[Smiley]

You can see a pretty major road going by the RPD. The gap is for the bus, obviously. Without those blocks and such there it's not a small road - you could certainly have a boss fight of some kind there. And then you can go and explore whole new sections of the city instead of, you know, making a whole new one anyway, slapping Raccoon City on some signs and hoping no one will notice. The downtown area also has some pretty major roads - again, you don't actually see a lot of them because the mess means they're chopped up, but you can see the outline.

I see the major road by the RPD if they were to remove the blockage. I can acknowledge that area would work for the war zone approach if they moved things around, however looking at that map most of those streets would not. We're talking minimalistic sections that could be tweaked properly as opposed to just starting from scratch here. And then you say they might as well have explored different sections of the city all around. I wouldn't be against doing that, but they didn't so I'm not going to fret.

And the thing too from your next comment is most people aren't complaining about the Raccoon City redesign. Newcomers won't care either way. People who are familiar with character and location redesigns in the series aren't fazed that a different team made their own version of the city for this type of game. It goes without saying that the layout for RE2 and 3 would not be done without major changes regardless so the only people I can see generally upset are those that had a preference in the Outbreak games. Because in two games they created a much larger city to explore in.

Resident Evils 4 and 5 are nowhere near as linear as Operation Raccoon City, and Resident Evil 4 is much less linear than Resident 5, at that.

They're all linear regardless of which one you say is more or less. If your definition of linear pacing is a "break in the action" then of course ORC will not live to your expectations. Granted the Wolf Pack aren't leaping and wall jumping off lasers, but the game is formatted to be in a constant battle with Spec Ops and any BOW that gets in either faction's way. Your examples of Gears of War and Vanquish do not meet the criteria of tactical four (or four on four) player co-op through a war zone setting. Gears of War and RE5 go hand in hand more with 1-2 player co-op that can afford to take breaks in the action of their story. Vanquish is a single player experience like RE4 so you can take breaks in the action accordingly. You're going to be looking at games like Left4Dead and Counter Strike where action and fighting is constant, and you need to work with a team to move your way through enemy attacks.

And their environments do take advantage of the game play style. That's why they are mapped out the way they are, and allow for chaotic experiences when dealing with Spec Ops and BOWs all at once. If you're expecting puzzles and the like then this is the wrong game to play.

If you ask me, taking the time to actually research the locations and environments from RE2, RE3, and the Outbreaks and faithfully re-creating them to the best of their power (while making some small sacrifices for the TPS squad-based nature of the game) would take a lot more work than making a new city from scratch that simply doesn't resemble Raccoon in the slightest.

We've gone over this before. Accepting the idea of recreating a location, but also saying it's needs to be faithful doesn't work. If you want to chalk it up to laziness then that's fine. But either way making locations from the ground up still takes time and effort even if they have to sacrifice not winning the hearts of some of the RE purists that wanted another Outbreak layout to travel though.

I did a bad thing.... :-( .....I feel dirty....Embarrased......Ashamed......I went to Blockbusters just to have a look wasnt decided on buying it or anything in all honesty was hoping to rent it. One of the workers there said he just bought it and how terrible it is and he was looking to sell it asap. So I gave him £30.....I need a shower.

One positive is I didnt boost their sales which looks like they are doing pretty damn well, he said there was people phoning all day to get it and couldnt find it anywhere. Sold out everywhere. At least I bought it second hand though. Uhhhhh I need to go wash and throw up.

Yes, I'm sure you feel just terrible. So are you going to play the game you bought or not? And if so, are you playing on ps3 or 360?

[[STARS]TyranT]

I got my version for 360 for the time being. If anyone fancies some matches or co-op run, add me, STARS TyranT

[Beanovsky Durst]

I got mine (PS3) for my birthday. Beanovsky-Durst on PSN, if you wanna kill some zombies.

[Archelon]

Has anyone else noticed this?

In the lab where you extract the Nemesis parasite from the T-103, there is a white board that says "Attn: RPD - Let's be safe out there." It's signed "Chief Irons."

On it, it lists the units that comprise the RPD, including STARS, but here's the kicker. They say STARS stands for "Special Tactics and Rescue Squad."

[Smiley]

I remember when the S.D. Perry novels and movies called it that. Anyone know where that originated from? I had thought it was from a manual to the earlier games but I'm not sure.

[Vito]

I got mine (PS3) for my birthday. Beanovsky-Durst on PSN, if you wanna kill some zombies.

I'll add you Sunday, when i get mine.