Losing interest in the series

[Shadow Stalker]

... hoping the Raccoon City game becomes a reality.

I wouldn't mind playing a game like that if it's officially greenlighted by Capcom Co., Ltd. I like Raccoon City. .... not the RE movie version of it, though.

Which reminds that the name Raccoon City is actually a pretty meaningful name regarding a series like Resident Evil.

Why? ... Here's why: -

What kind of animal is famous for spreading, by bite, a disease that makes the afflicted animals become violent and crazy? ... Raccoons.

[BrionIrons]

They can, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be profitable. It has paid off for them with RE4 and (financially) with RE5 as well. It revamped a stale series and brought a new casual audience to the RE games. However, I strongly believe if they don't make some serious changes to "DmC", then it's going to bomb and they may use it as an excuse to discontinue the franchise. That is a series that didn't need changing and I am still baffled as to why they've taken that direction with the series, and changed the iconic Dante which fans have grown to love. This has made me lose faith in Capcom personally.

How to do a reboot - Tomb Raider.

How to NOT do a reboot - "DmC".

You couldn't have said it better Ashford.

[Dracarys]

How to do a reboot - Tomb Raider.

How to NOT do a reboot - "DmC".

When you say Tomb Raider do you mean Legend? Because if you mean the upcomming one then they've changed Lara as much as Dante in DmC. Crossbows, horses and brutal melee kills...oh yeah I remember Lara doing those?

[Alexia_Ashford]

When you say Tomb Raider do you mean Legend? Because if you mean the upcomming one then they've changed Lara as much as Dante in DmC. Crossbows, horses and brutal melee kills...oh yeah I remember Lara doing those?

Sorry but I don't see the relevance. The new "Tomb Raider" is set before the games of the past, hence her youthful appearance. It is the same character model, her appearance hasn't been altered other than perhaps smaller boobs, a younger look and a more "battered" look due to the style of the game. The "kills" you speak of is consistent with the style of the new game, more survival horror and a desperate struggle to survive on an Island full of hostile enemies, a la RE4, instead of "Oh, I'm going to hunt this long-lost treasure and encounter a few baddies on the way". It looks to be a highly interesting and fresh approach to the series, still being made by the guys who did the previous games, renovating a series which was beginning to feel stale and generating fresh hype/fans. The same thing RE4 did for RE.

They are not, however, completely changing the character model, giving the character an emo fringe, giving it to an outside developer and leaving the same style of game/gameplay which Bayonetta has already done and bettered a year ago. Showing us Lara in her youth and giving her a slightly more rough look and a new style of gameplay is hardly taking an established iconic character like Dante and turning him into that. I don't see the point of "rebooting" a character than fans have grown very attached to (and perhaps the only really memorable character in the DMC games to non-fans), but not rebooting the gameplay.

Are you seriously saying you think the DmC reboot will be better than the Tomb Raider one?

[Guest]

They are not, however, completely changing the character model, giving the character an emo fringe

At the moment, as someone from an outside perspective who has yet to play any Devil May Cry game, I think that the new design is superior to the old Dante. But I can fully relate to the sentiments from fans as I also hate it when a series goes down a completely different path with external developers (see Silent Hill).

They can, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be profitable. It has paid off for them with RE4 and (financially) with RE5 as well.

You're placing the brackets as if the game is bad or universally hated. That's just not the case.
And the series, despite the shift in focus, is more financially successful than ever before. Even Resident Evil: Degeneration, a lackluster 3D movie, made half a million dollars at the box office with limited screenings and later sold 1.6 million DVD and Blu-ray copies. If there is one thing that won't happen to them with their current course for Resident Evil, it's a sales decline.

[Alexia_Ashford]

At the moment, as someone from an outside perspective who has yet to play any Devil May Cry game, I think that the new design is superior to the old Dante. But I can fully relate to the sentiments from fans as I also hate it when a series goes down a completely different path with external developers (see Silent Hill).

I have been a fan of the DMC series since the demo disc of DMC1 which came with RE: CVX. I love the characters and series, there is so much story left to explore. Fans have been begging for Vergil since DMC3, at the end of DMC1 Dante states he knows Mundus will return, and we still have the big rebellion of Sparda against the demon world which we've never seen in game form or even in a cutscene. Dante was iconic to the series and to Capcom. The new trailers have been enough to completely put me off this new game. I don't understand how it is supposed to make sales when it's already royally pissed off the DMC fanbase with this new character and the gameplay doesn't seem radically different. It's not going to feel revolutionary like RE4 because other games have already topped what the DMC series has. I agree it needed gameplay changes, but not no gameplay change and a complete character re-design. From what I've seen, any gameplay changes will be minimal.

Shawn at Capcom said "not to worry" and it might not "be what I think", so all I could assume from that is this might not be the 'proper' Dante. Doubt it though. It will also be worse because it will not be 60 FPS.

You're placing the brackets as if the game is bad or universally hated. That's just not the case.
And the series, despite the shift in focus, is more financially successful than ever before. Even Resident Evil: Degeneration, a lackluster 3D movie, made half a million dollars at the box office with limited screenings and later sold 1.6 million DVD and Blu-ray copies. If there is one thing that won't happen to them with their current course for Resident Evil, it's a sales decline.

I never said anything like that, that is completely your own assumption. I don't think it's particularly 'bad' or hated, it was just not as ground-breaking or revered as RE4. RE4 is the game that reinvented the series, brought the new casual audience in, and RE4 has even gained some respect from the hardcore fans who once used to dismiss the game. RE5, however, has seemed to split fans into a Marmite category - really enjoy it, or strongly dislike it. The co-op, the story. I dislike it personally because of what it tried to be - RE4, I can just play it, enjoy it and it doesn't hold any real bearing on the canon.

When I was referring to finance, it was for DMC, not RE. RE will continue to sell loads until people get bored of it and the next best thing comes along. Casual fans are many, but fickle. They play for entertainment, not story. Like others have said before, they can cater to both audiences, and Revelations seems to be more of a compromise than RE5. It will just be interesting to see what the next numbered entry will bring.

[Smiley]

Capcom says a lot of things these days. I'm theorizing that this Dante is from an alternate reality and may come to meet the old Dante. Think the Star Trek reboot.

As far as I'm concerned though they could be talking out of their ass. Like when RE5 was marketed as 'fear you won't forget'. Trust issues with the company are to be expected, and rude awakenings like the sales for Darkside Chronicles might make Capcom get the hint someday when over-the-shoulder shoot em ups grow stale and unimaginative as they have with rail shooters on the wii.

[Alexia_Ashford]

Capcom says a lot of things these days. I'm theorizing that this Dante is from an alternate reality and may come to meet the old Dante. Think the Star Trek reboot.

As far as I'm concerned though they could be talking out of their ass. Like when RE5 was marketed as 'fear you won't forget'. Trust issues with the company are to be expected, and rude awakenings like the sales for Darkside Chronicles might make Capcom get the hint someday when over-the-shoulder shoot em ups grow stale and unimaginative as they have with rail shooters on the wii.

I agree. RE4 was great for its time but RE5 felt like it hadn't really built on that formula and felt the same, with forced co-op, which imo made it worse. Reminds me of Molyneux's interview about Fable 2, saying it was a brilliant story which we'd remember for a lifetime. Hardly known such a crap story in my life.

[Pikminister]

Some DMC fans are so dedicated (or fanatical, take yer pick) that when they saw the new design, some of them went "OMFG I see some gray hairs on Neo-Dante's head! Maybe this is when his hair started to go gray! Maybe as you progress into the game you'll see his hair get grayer and grayer.".

I don't remember where I read that. I dunno if it was THIA or gamefaqs. It just made me laugh. A lot.

The best recent reboot of a franchise that actually worked was Donkey Kong Country.

After Rare Ltd. abandoned Ninty, it seemed like we would never see another entry in that series. And leave it to Retro Studios (who also rebooted Metroid) to make the magic happen all over again. Donkey Kong Country Returns has sold like crazy during the holidays. Welcome back you crazy ape.

[Alexia_Ashford]

Some DMC fans are so dedicated (or fanatical, take yer pick) that when they saw the new design, some of them went "OMFG I see some gray hairs on Neo-Dante's head! Maybe this is when his hair started to go gray! Maybe as you progress into the game you'll see his hair get grayer and grayer.".

I don't remember where I read that. I dunno if it was THIA or gamefaqs. It just made me laugh. A lot.

The best recent reboot of a franchise that actually worked was Donkey Kong Country.

After Rare Ltd. abandoned Ninty, it seemed like we would never see another entry in that series. And leave it to Retro Studios (who also rebooted Metroid) to make the magic happen all over again. Donkey Kong Country Returns has sold like crazy during the holidays. Welcome back you crazy ape.

I really enjoyed DKC:R, but it didn't feel the same as the originals to me. I felt the difficulty was just too hard and whereas the first 3 were really challenging but do-able and required skill, the final levels on Returns was just crazy and pretty much guesswork.

About the grey hair, I saw that on Capcommunity and 4Chan I believe.

[Pikminister]

I really enjoyed DKC:R, but it didn't feel the same as the originals to me. I felt the difficulty was just too hard and whereas the first 3 were really challenging but do-able and required skill, the final levels on Returns was just crazy and pretty much guesswork.

About the grey hair, I saw that on Capcommunity and 4Chan I believe.

Point is, Retro Studios nailed it with the DKC reboot. Totally nailed it. It's a perfect example of how reboots should be made.

I mean when you have publications saying "It's not only the best Donkey Kong Country, it's also one of the best platformers I've ever played", you know you got a winner. Because Retro Studios could've ruined it. But gawd bless those knuckleheads. They pulled it off. This despite loosing some important team members.

BTW, Rare Ltd. was actually losing it's magic by the third game. And by the time they made Donkey Kong 64, it was clear that they had none of that anymore.

4chan? I don't go to 4chan. So maybe I read that at that Capcom community thing.

How I ended up there, is beyond me.

[Alexia_Ashford]

Yeah, DK 64 was bad. DKC:R just didn't feel like DKC2 to me. That had challenge but DKC:R felt like timing and repetition. It was a fun platformer though, especially on the earlier levels. Slightly frustrating on the later ones, but fun.

[Dracarys]

Sorry but I don't see the relevance. The new "Tomb Raider" is set before the games of the past, hence her youthful appearance. It is the same character model, her appearance hasn't been altered other than perhaps smaller boobs, a younger look and a more "battered" look due to the style of the game. The "kills" you speak of is consistent with the style of the new game, more survival horror and a desperate struggle to survive on an Island full of hostile enemies, a la RE4, instead of "Oh, I'm going to hunt this long-lost treasure and encounter a few baddies on the way". It looks to be a highly interesting and fresh approach to the series, still being made by the guys who did the previous games, renovating a series which was beginning to feel stale and generating fresh hype/fans. The same thing RE4 did for RE.

They are not, however, completely changing the character model, giving the character an emo fringe, giving it to an outside developer and leaving the same style of game/gameplay which Bayonetta has already done and bettered a year ago. Showing us Lara in her youth and giving her a slightly more rough look and a new style of gameplay is hardly taking an established iconic character like Dante and turning him into that. I don't see the point of "rebooting" a character than fans have grown very attached to (and perhaps the only really memorable character in the DMC games to non-fans), but not rebooting the gameplay.

Are you seriously saying you think the DmC reboot will be better than the Tomb Raider one?

Depends what you mean by better, the new TR sounds like it is departing from the older games a fair amount and will be different rather than better or worse. Her image is very different too I don't get your saying it isn't.

Look at these images, without being told I doubt anyone would have known it was Lara Croft just seeing the left one.

Spoiler:

show spoiler

Why does Lara get to use a "a younger look and a more "battered" look" defence but Dante doesn't btw?


Goes for most of the defences just posted for TR, they all extend to DmC.

[Rombie]

As I just said in the DmC topic - the reason is simple, people aren't over the original Dante. It's just that simple.

Lara has remained reletively unchanged in over 15 years... they've made her younger before, a teen, they've remade the original game and tried a franchise rescue before (with Legend, Anniversary, and Underworld)... which weren't bad, but they were in the end just a reskin of what existed.

This Tomb Raider change is what the franchise needs to maintain relevance, but DmC is not what that series needs right now. As I also said in the topic, the last game was the best seller in the series... the reason the backlash was so vocal is because that fan base is expecting a continuation, they aren't bored of the existing franchise and they let it be known.

Compare that to Tomb Raider and the reverse is true, the majority believe it's a good change because it is what it needs.

What I didn't say in the DmC topic because I forgot, is ironically the change to DMC/DmC is probably due to Dante's own creator.... and his work doing Bayonetta over at Platinum. Capcom probably looked at the crtical responce to that and figured if they change the way DMC works by rebooting it it gives more freedom to work on a system that is closer to Bayonetta's. Because a more flexable combat system is relevant. I believe this because in the trailer Dante is shown using a heck of a lot more melee and weapon connecting moves than his original counterpart would have. Of course I won't be sure till I see the game in motion, but I'm expecting that we'll see Ninja Theory has been taking pages out of the witches rule book personally.

[Alexia_Ashford]

Dante's new look isn't a younger, battered look. It's a completely unnecessary re-design, we have no idea how old he actually is and everything about him has changed. Even his mannerisms. His re-design isn't done to fit with the new setting, Lara's is. She's younger, it's her first real adventure and she is trying to survive. Seems a bit to me like you're debating for the sake of it if you don't think the TR reboot will be better or worse and you don't seem to have much of an opinion on the DmC reboot.

About all the other points I made, Rombie just explained it perfectly with the post above and about why Tomb Raider is how to do a reboot and DmC is not:

This Tomb Raider change is what the franchise needs to maintain relevance, but DmC is not what that series needs right now.


Compare that to Tomb Raider and the reverse is true, the majority believe it's a good change because it is what it needs.

She looks a LOT more like a realistic version of Lara instead of a cartoony huge-titted version, than Dante looks like his counterpart:

Spoiler:

show spoiler

He does, infact, look very similar to this guy:

Spoiler:

show spoiler