Wesker's Report - Canonicity Debate (or the Official "WTF Hiroki Kato!?" Thread)

[Dracarys]

I never said the magazine said anything about a retcon, the magazine was talking about RE 3.5 (before it was canned and when it was still due to release) and how Leon became infected.

I said it was likely retconned when RE 3.5 was canned.

[Fruit Salad]

ban news bot

[News Bot]

Stu is right, I already gave you an answer. A factual one read clear as day from a magazine interview, so not theory or anything. You've dismissed it as wrong though just 'because'.

It came from the mouth of someone making 3.5 and I have never seen a single reason to not to believe it. Gaiden would lead into RE 3.5 but was retconned outta canon when 3.5 got axed, but by this time Weskers Report has referenced it.

Uhh, no... You haven't provided anything. You don't even know the name of the magazine, you're going off memory alone and can't back it up. We only have your word for it. That's not evidence. Tangible. No better than just making up sources altogether.

The only other article I can think of that you could be referring to is the CUBE article but that is mostly made up by the editors and doesn't contain an interview from what I recall and while it incorporates elements from Gaiden's plot (anti-Umbrella organization and Leon working for the U.S. government at the same time, Wesker's Report, etc), it mentions nothing about it being retconned. In fact, I don't think any of the developers have ever openly stated that something was retconned (the series contains virtually no retcons anyway).

Doesn't Leon being killed in gaiden invalidate that part of WR?
If you ignore the report, what does the overall canon lose? Esp since uc and dsc have incorporated alot of it. And I'd say there's grounds to ignore it, given it being wrong on at least the two points you mention, and the Sherry debacle.

Just curious. Are you using a translated Japanese version or the English?

I think you're right about that. UC and DC did pretty much take the plot elements introduced in Wesker's Report and work them in. We using the English version but translating specific parts that are iffy, we haven't done a full accurate translation yet.

I may be wrong, but have any of them actually said that? Just because it was ignored after the plot changed doesn't mean they never intended to do something with it. It seems odd that Capcom would allow one of there main characters to be written out like that without Capcom consenting to it, and having some idea about what do with it.

I mean, it seems likely that originally Sherry was going to be a plot point, her being in Wesker's possession. Capcom have dropped intended plot points before.

I don't think it really needs to be said, it's pretty evident. Sugimura's canon never referenced Gaiden once and this wasn't going to change with any of his versions of BH4. People like KylieDog misunderstand the whole Gaiden plot device of the B.O.W. impersonation and get the idea that Leon was actually "infected", which is simply nonsense (by bleeding green blood, even though Gaiden makes it explicitly clear that bleeding green blood means that the subject isn't human, it's the B.O.W.). For one thing, the B.O.W. is made with the t-virus at best, while Leon was infected with the Progenitor virus.

I don't think Sherry was ever in Wesker's possession though, I think that's just a misunderstanding altogether. The Inside of Biohazard The Darkside Chronicles confirms that once she was taken into U.S. custody, Wesker had access to her through his spies in the U.S. Government. She was in his hands regardless. So, they kept that plot point from Wesker's Report but just changed it slightly.

I think Archelon got it in regards to WR being superseded by UC and DC.

[Dracarys]

If I'm ever looking through my old stuff at my dads I'll have a look for it and prove it. I'll be honest though, I'm not likely to do this for a very long time. Its been in his loft for almost a decade along with lots of other stuff of mine and in all that time I've only once had a reason to go up there and get something. This isn't even important to me.

Stu is right, I already gave you an answer. A factual one read clear as day from a magazine interview, so not theory or anything. You've dismissed it as wrong though just 'because'.

It came from the mouth of someone making 3.5 and I have never seen a single reason to not to believe it. Gaiden would lead into RE 3.5 but was retconned outta canon when 3.5 got axed, but by this time Weskers Report has referenced it.

I'll call BS on that one. There was never any in-depth interview on the early versions of RE4 except for the EGM one with Hiroyuki Kobayashi from April 2005. That, and the fake interview from GamingWorld X, but not even that establishes a connection to Gaiden.

[Archelon]

If you ignore the report, what does the overall canon lose?

The overall canon loses pretty much nothing if you ignore WR, but then, you could say the same thing about the spinoff games, too.

But as I said, UC (and DSC to an extent) effectively replaces WR by incorporating the aspects of it that are still relevant (Wesker injecting himself with the super virus, Wesker "saving" Ada, Ada retrieving a tissue sample rather than Sherry's pendant) while nixing the rest (Sherry being in Wesker's hands, Leon joining an underground anti-Umbrella group, HUNK retrieving the G-Virus sample Leon threw away).

[Mr_Zombie]

I haven't played Gaiden in a while (and I'm not planning to replay it ever), but does the B.O.W. have the ability to clone? Because at the end of the game "Leon", Barry and Lucia are fighting it, so if "Leon" really is a B.O.W. in disguise, then that would mean there are actually two shape-shifting monsters on the ship.

[TheSelfishGene]

Doesn't Leon being killed in gaiden invalidate that part of WR?
If you ignore the report, what does the overall canon lose? Esp since uc and dsc have incorporated alot of it. And I'd say there's grounds to ignore it, given it being wrong on at least the two points you mention, and the Sherry debacle.

Just curious. Are you using a translated Japanese version or the English?

[Darkmoon]

Sure. Hypothetically. But hypothetically I could have a 12 inch penis. Doesn't make it true. Circumstantial evidence points to his silly hair being at the bottom of the ocean and since Gaiden has and will never be followed up on there's no reason to believe otherwise apart from "what-if" and that simply isn't good enough. And there was no link between Gaiden and BH4. Sugimura did not acknowledge Gaiden and neither has any other writer in the series ever.

I may be wrong, but have any of them actually said that? Just because it was ignored after the plot changed doesn't mean they never intended to do something with it. It seems odd that Capcom would allow one of there main characters to be written out like that without Capcom consenting to it, and having some idea about what do with it.

I mean, it seems likely that originally Sherry was going to be a plot point, her being in Wesker's possession. Capcom have dropped intended plot points before.

Stu is right, I already gave you an answer. A factual one read clear as day from a magazine interview, so not theory or anything. You've dismissed it as wrong though just 'because'.

It came from the mouth of someone making 3.5 and I have never seen a single reason to not to believe it. Gaiden would lead into RE 3.5 but was retconned outta canon when 3.5 got axed, but by this time Weskers Report has referenced it.

The problem is that right now, we only have your word for this. I can explain to everyone that Shinji Mikami himself told me Leon is actually a clone created from a sample found of a hairbrush believed to have been used by Jesus, but without proof...

News Bot is dismissing it because it's not a source he's ever seen.

[Vito]

I think since the day they decided to cut that bit about Sherry form the report is the day said report lost all its creability.

[Dracarys]

Stu is right, I already gave you an answer. A factual one read clear as day from a magazine interview, so not theory or anything. You've dismissed it as wrong though just 'because'.

It came from the mouth of someone making 3.5 and I have never seen a single reason to not to believe it. Gaiden would lead into RE 3.5 but was retconned outta canon when 3.5 got axed, but by this time Weskers Report has referenced it.

[Archelon]

I still feel that both Umbrella Chronicles and Darkside Chronicles have superseded Wesker's Report. UC in particular always seemed to me like an expansion of Wesker's Report that essentially replaced it in the canon.

But that's just me.

[News Bot]

Again, turning it into something it's not. Just making an observation that any time you "seek guidance" from the community, it just turns into you knocking away 99% of the help that you're offered.

Distaste? Your penchant for thinking more of yourself than anyone else actually does speaks volumes.

I can't help it when other people are simply wrong y'know. I do back up pretty much everything I say one way or another (initially I never really sourced anything because ugh, effort). Most people I've ever debated with have not. KylieDog is a prime example.

You over-inflate my ego in your head. You do realize how much I've actually written about the series on Project Umbrella alone in the form of articles, of which there are thousands of? Not to mention that 60+ page timeline, or the videos I continue to make, or the money I pay to keep Project Umbrella running, or the things I've bought just to make them public including several hundred pounds worth of guide books alone which I then tore apart page by page just to scan for everyone else, and even more with other rare disks, etc. I have never watermarked a single piece of content that comes from me nor do I ever withhold anything. There are people on the forum who know me outside of it and what I'm really like in regards to most of this stuff, you're not one of them. My arguments on the forum aren't really an accurate reflection of anything, they're mostly frustrated ramblings at the inability of someone to accept being incorrect. I always accept when I'm wrong (I do so regularly with Prime Blue), others don't, I get pissed, present evidence, they ignore, I get more pissed.

My attitude might suck on the forum but I'm definitely not just in this out of self-obsession. Those here and elsewhere that actually know me well can probably vouch for that. I actually like you Stu, but you've got the wrong idea.

EDIT: Ecliptic Express coming through! Now get back on topic. Stu, you have never and probably will never contribute anything to a topic like this other than to criticize me or deliberately derail it so please, stop posting. If you want to pick apart my psyche and start making observations, PM me or something or hell, make a topic about it if you're so interested in making personal observations about me on a forum.

[Stu]

Again, turning it into something it's not. Just making an observation that any time you "seek guidance" from the community, it just turns into you knocking away 99% of the help that you're offered.

Distaste? Your penchant for thinking more of yourself than anyone else actually does speaks volumes.

[News Bot]

ITT: News Bot start a thread purely to show off his perceived superior knowledge of the Resident Evil.

Haven't we been here several times before Paul?

The thread was actually started because I have no clue. And I do know a lot. I can't really deny that. That's only because we have access to more sources and therefore more information than most people (which we in turn, share). If you're just gonna rail on me for posting said information (something of a hobby for you from time to time) then really, there's no point in you posting. Leave it at that Stu and don't give this topic one of your spectacular Ecliptic Express treatments. This is a serious discussion and I feel we can get somewhere with it after bringing all the facts together.

For the sake of everyone here calm your distaste for me or story discussions.